Welcome to the eighty-first episode of Access On, the National Federation of the Blind's Technology podcast.
Episode
Listen to the eighty-first episode of the Access On podcast (Browser).
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Timestamps
Below is what's on the show this week, and when you can hear it.
- Register for our Access On gaming webinar 0:00:00
- Technology-related events at #NFB26 0:01:35
- Brett Boyer, president of the NFB's Assistive Technology Trainers Division 0:16:25
- BBC radio outside the UK 0:29:32
- Saving recordings in Ootunes 0:30
- Thoughts on AI 0:31:23
- Comments on Speaky AI 0:33:16
- Bose abandoning voice prompts 0:37:14
- Is the increasing call for certification in access technology training locking out capable blind people? 0:38:46
- Network attached storage devices 0:42:06
- My new wonderful kitchen assistant 0:45:19
- Putting an audio setup together for live NFB events 0:46:02
- Comments on recent Microsoft and Apple announcements 0:51:46
- Perplexity 0:53:44
- The Tovala smart oven 0:54:57
- Missing tones on Alexa devices 0:58:34
Transcript
Access On episode 81 Looking ahead to NFB26 and listener feedback
Speaker 1:
Access On.
Jonathan Mosen:
Welcome to another episode of Access On, the technology podcast of the National Federation of the Blind. If you started packing your bags for national convention in Austin, we tell you about some of the tech-related sessions. Brett Boyer, president of our Technology Trainers Division discusses what's happening at their convention meeting. How necessary should it be to have certification when you want to be an access technology instructor? And Access On listeners from around the world provide feedback on a wide range of tech-related issues.
It's Jonathan Mosen at the Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, Maryland, welcoming you to episode 81 of the podcast. We are getting ever closer to our Access On webinar, which is going to be all about gaming this month. This happens on June 30th from 2:00 until 3:30 PM Eastern. And we're going to be looking at gaming in a range of contacts: on your computer, on your smartphone, and of course the increasing number of accessible games that are available for games consoles. There'll be time for Q&A as well, so why not register? Head on over to nfb.org/cena. That's nfb.org/cena. Choose the events and training link, and you'll find the form there to register for this webinar. If you can't make it in person, you will get a recording if you register, and we'll also feature the webinar in a future episode of Access On.
And not long after that webinar, many of us are heading to Austin, Texas for the 2026 National Convention of the National Federation of the Blind. This is so exciting. We're looking forward to seeing many of you there. And I thought it could be helpful if we take a look at some of the events relating to technology that you might want to attend at convention. The authoritative source for all things convention is nfb.org/convention.
But we do live in this wondrous age of vibe coding. And JJ Meddaugh, who many people will know from A.T. Guys, he's also a member of the National Federation of the Blind, he has vibe coded a convention agenda builder, and it's pretty slick. It's accessible, and it saved me a whole lot of time when I was putting events into my calendar. If you want to try that, you can go to nfb26.atguys.com.
And this is the convention agenda on one page, nicely segmented by checkbox. You go through and check the box for each item you're interested in attending. When you navigate by checkbox, you should hear the event item name, and then you can scroll down to hear more of the description if that interests you. Check the boxes for all the events you might want to attend. Sometimes you get a clash. There's more than one event that you want to attend at the same time, such as the wealth of information that we have access to when we all gather together in convention like this and there are so many seminars and interesting things. If you find yourself in that position, you don't have to decide today; you can check the box for items that occur at the same time and then just see how you feel on the day.
Go to nfb26.atguys.com, check the boxes. At the end of the process, there's the ability to build a calendar file. You can then import that calendar file often just by going to your file manager of choice, whether it's File Explorer or Finder or whatever it is. And if you activate the calendar, it'll import into your default calendar app. It's very straightforward and can save you a lot of time. And of course, there's also the mobile convention app; that is the official NFB26 convention app. That will allow you to mark events that you want to attend as well and build your own personalized list from within the app.
Given the tech focused nature of Access On, here are some items for techies or wannabe techies that you might want to look for at convention. And let's start with July 3rd. And actually, we start with the NFB's own Center of Excellence and Non-Visual Accessibility, who, at 8:30 that morning, bright and early on the Friday, are putting on a seminar called The AI Landscape: ChatGPT, Claude, Gemini, and Accessibility. You're going to get a practical overview of major AI changes affecting blind users, comparing ChatGPT, Claude, and Gemini for strengths, limits, and accessible real world uses, plus trends and new features reshaping productivity, information access, and everyday tech. And we're going to dig into areas such as music creation, working with visual tools to either interpret or create visual things, and plenty of time for talk about vibe coding. We're going to have a couple of guests who will be talking to us about that specific subject, which is causing so much excitement out there at the moment as the barriers to entry in terms of blind people creating solutions to our own accessibility challenges are coming crashing down. There are things to be aware of. There are potential pitfalls, and we'll cover those as well in that seminar at 8:30 in the morning on July 3rd.
You can, at 10:00 AM until 11:00 AM, go to Target: Accessible to All. This is where you can join members of Target's Digital Accessibility Team to learn what's new at the bullseye. Bring your questions and share your feedback about Target's digital experiences. This will be an interactive conversational session.
Also at that same time, 10:00 AM on Friday, July 3rd, updates from Monarch and more with APH. You can join APH for demonstrations of upcoming products, Monarch version 1.5, and more. See revolutionary tech at work and be the first to hear about the newest product developments and improvements. Bring your questions, enthusiasm, and curiosity. You can bring your Monarch too, of course, if you have one. I'll be bringing one to convention for sure.
At 11:00 AM on that Friday, July the 3rd, there's your first opportunity to look at an interesting new app. And we had a visit from those working on this at the International Braille and Technology Center. This is EZ Receipts built by us for us. You can join their founder, Alberto Destarac for a live demo of the first app that delivers itemized digital receipts to your phone the moment you pay. No scanning, no asking for help at checkout. Hear it work with VoiceOver and TalkBack this time for Q&A, hands-on testing, and feedback.
And I'm sure there'll be some tech references at the Committee for the Advancement and Promotion of Braille. That's from 1:00 until 4:00. The committee will discuss Braille-related resources and activities across our organization, development and the teaching and delivery of Braille, research priorities, Braille-related policy and strategies for bringing improvements where needed.
At 1:00, you can also go to What's New at HumanWare. Join the HumanWare team for an upbeat session. Discover the BrailleNote Evolve, a Windows 11 computer in a compact Braille device powered by KeySoft and NVDA. Explore the latest victory to stream updates, various Braille displays, and the new Meta smart glasses.
And the team from NFB Center for Excellence and Non-Visual Accessibility isn't done yet because at 2:00 there's another seminar from us. It is called Building Technology Confidence. And Brett Boyer's going to talk about this in a little bit when we have him on this week's episode. Learn to pick tech that fits your needs and learning style. Use AI for structured exploration, troubleshooting, and step-by-step learning. Build lasting confidence through experimenting, making mistakes, and solving problems instead of avoiding failure.
At 4:00 PM, you can learn about the next generation of Be My Eyes. Join with Be My Eyes for a whirlwind tour of the latest features, redesigns, and tools coming to the platform. Experience live demos and agentic call mode, refreshed mobile and desktop interfaces, and more as we showcase what's new and what's next.
Then if you're interested in technology, this is one that I really would not miss ever when I go to convention. It's at 6:30, and it is the Technology Exhibitors Showcase. Join us to learn about low and high-tech products from hardware to software and more. Hear the latest from our vendors at this session. What I like about this is that you can sit down and get comfortable after your first long day at the convention and have the exhibitors come to you, and they will tell you about what's exciting from their perspective at their booths. You can write a list of things that you really don't want to miss when the exhibit hall opens and you go to have a look at all that technology.
That takes us to Saturday, July 4th, and at 10:00 AM there's Microsoft 365 Copilot: Reimagine Productivity. Hear how accessibility and AI work across Microsoft 365 Copilot, Narrator, agentic authoring and page creation to drive productivity for everyone. Presented by blind support engineers at Microsoft.
And also at 10:00 AM, you could go to What's New in Google Accessibility. This session provides a summary of recent updates to accessibility features across Google products. And then at 11:00, JAWS, AI, and what's new in screen reading, discover how AI is transforming screen reading and enhancing productivity and independence. Get a look at what's coming next in JAWS and what using a computer looks like in the future. At 11:30, Microsoft Copilot and Seeing AI. Learn the latest from AI thought leaders and blind innovators at Microsoft.
From 2:00 to 3:00 PM, it's an Android accessibility update. This session focuses on recent developments within Android designed for the blind and low vision community. From 5:00 to 6:30, it's Aira! Access Is a Human Right. Join the Aira team to explore their latest innovations, discover hands-free visual interpreting with Meta glasses, get involved with training their project Astra-powered AI, and learn how to access Aira for free. The future of accessibility is here; come be a part of it.
That takes us to July the 5th, and at 12:30 there's the meeting of the National Federation of the Blind in Computer Science, enhancing non-visual access to information technology and improving the ability of blind information and computer technology professionals to compete in today's world. And at 5:00, you have the opportunity to play accessibility jeopardy by popular demand after its debut at NFB '25. Accessibility Jeopardy is back, better and funnier than ever, hosted by A11y Trebek, you won't want to miss this session full of laughs, friendly competition, and a secret prize for the winner of Final Jeopardy.
And also at 5:00 until 7:00, it's the Assistive Technology Trainers Division, a space for access tech instructors to connect, talk shop, teach, and learn from each other. Join us for panels on multiline Braille displays, strategies and structured discovery techniques and why they work. Open forum on topics like using AI, teaching tips, resources, and more.
Also at 5:00, it is the EchoVision demo and tutorial co-designed from the ground up with the Blind and Low Vision Community. EchoVision integrates world-class AI into a lightweight, stylish wearable designed for one thing, empowerment. Or at 5:00, you could also go to Tell Us How to Fix Self-Service. Self-service fails blind users every day. Storm Interface builds accessible kiosk technology, and they want to hear from you. Tell them what's broken, what's worked, and what the industry keeps getting wrong.
I'm going to come back to the general sessions at the end of this and have a look at some of the technology presentations; July the 6th is when they begin. But there are a couple of things to tell you about outside general sessions. From 12:00 until 2:00 on that July 6th, Braille for Active Lives. Discover how the Dot Pad X brings multiline Braille to your active life. Learn how to seamlessly connect to iOS, Windows, and note-takers for unparalleled access to books, apps, documents, and more.
And at 1:00, Making Amazon Shopping Easier. Learn about the latest accessibility features that make navigating and shopping on Amazon faster and more intuitive. Discover how AI powered tools and improved navigation help customers find products and information more efficiently and create a more inclusive shopping experience.
On July 7th at noon, it's Accessibility Officer Charity Testathon. Bring your laptop, see how you stake up against real accessibility testers, win cash prices, and help deserving charity get their website accessible at the two-hour AccessAbility Officer Charity Testathon.
Also at 12:00, What If the Screen Reader Never Had to Ask? Since 1997, screen readers have all worked the same way: ask the app what's on-screen. We tried something different. Come hear how Amazon built a faster screen reader from scratch, now shipping on select Fire TV devices.
Also at 1:00, Amazon Entertainment Takes It to 11. Explore Amazon's latest innovations and entertainment accessibility, including adaptive display, dialogue boosts, audio description, and advanced hearing aid connectivity on Fire TV. Learn how these features work together to create a more inclusive streaming experience.
At 6:00, it's Ray-Ban Meta: Going Further for BLV. Ray Ban Meta glasses have been breaking down barriers for the blind and low vision community since coming to market. Meta says in their description, "We listened to users and improved features to make our technology more accessible. Come learn what we've built this year and get a sneak peek into the future."
On the final day of convention, July 8th at 1:00, it's Technology Accessibility Listening Session. Meet the NFB's Committee on Accessibility and User Innovation. We want to hear from our members about what really matters to them regarding their use of technology. What is working? What isn't working? What does it mean when an item of technology is accessible to the blind?
Now, there is so much of value from the general sessions of the national convention, including, of course, the President's Report and many other important presentations, but since this is Access On, let's focus on the technology-centered presentations at this year's national convention general sessions. In the afternoon in general session two on the first day, you'll be able to hear Build, Lead, and Innovate: Transforming Expectations Through Blind-Centered Solutions. And this is from Mike Calvo, CEO and co-founder of Pneuma Solutions. And after that, you'll be able to hear Keep Accessibility Advancing: Continuous Innovation Influenced by the Blind. This is Neil Barnett; he is the new chief accessibility officer of Microsoft.
Now, in addition to those technology-centric items, there is so much more to see and do over the period of national convention. Do check it out. nfb.org/convention is your hub for NFB '26, nfb.org/convention. If you're not coming to Austin, you can register for the NFB virtual experience.
Registration is only 10 dollars, and it gives you access to the convention app, and it also makes you eligible for door prices, so be sure to be listening to every minute of general session on NFBRN or on YouTube because you never know when your name might come up. And the registration's open right throughout convention, but why not get it done now while it's on your mind? nfb.org/convention if you're not coming to Austin, but you'd like to register for the virtual experience.
National convention is drawing ever closer. Hopefully you're making your plans for Austin, you're checking the agenda on the convention webpage or wherever it makes sense for you to check it and you're making plans. And if you're listening to this podcast, one thing you may wish to plan to do is to attend the Tech Trainers Division meeting. And joining us once again this year to tell us about the Tech Trainers Division and to look ahead to what is happening in Austin for our 2026 convention, it's the president of the Tech Trainers Division, Brett Boyer in sunny Colorado. Welcome to you, Brett.
Brett Boyer:
Well, hello my friend. Always sunny here in Colorado.
Jonathan Mosen:
Yeah, it's nice to have you back. All that lovely clean mountaineer, you'll be full of vim and vigor. For those who weren't listening last year or who might be new to the Federation, give us a bit of an overview of why we have this division. What is its purpose?
Brett Boyer:
Well, originally the Tech Trainers Division was, I think, set up the access assistive technology I think we're still calling it. We are looking at a name change. But the Assistive Technology Division was when there was a smaller pool of blind tech teachers. The pool has gotten a lot bigger, which is great. It's great to see so many blind tech trainers, but it also means that not everybody knows necessarily the best ways to teach tech. We end up having a lot of techies that are great with tech, but the training part is sometimes something that people need to learn more about and learn from some folks who've been doing this for a long time. It's to support all access tech trainers, but more specifically our blind tech trainers. And because we are NFB, it of course really supports a lot of structured discovery. That doesn't mean you have to be well versed in structured discovery to come to our meetings, but we definitely like to show off why structured discovery works in our access tech field. Most of the time when people hear structured discovery, they think travel.
And if you've read any of my articles in the monitor or you've heard my speech last year at the rehab conference, you know that in my opinion, tech and travel go hand in hand as far as overcoming barriers, understanding that just because the computer worked today doesn't mean it's going to work tomorrow the right way. And how do we become resilient or show our students how to become resilient when things don't work or a new update comes out or a keystroke that you used to rely on for 15 years has now changed? This is why we feel this division is super important. And as tech trainers, it's even more important to understand how to train this way and to be around those type of people who have this belief in blind people.
Jonathan Mosen:
We're with you 100% on this. And in fact, the NFB Center of Excellence and Non-Visual Accessibility is devoting the afternoon session on seminar day, which is the opening day of the convention, July 3rd, to this whole question of structured discovery because so often people are taught to work with a product by rote, and then that set of instructions breaks for some reason and people are struggling. If you understand the concepts, the ability to explore and work your way out of a problem, those are the sorts of tools that set you up for a lifetime of access. Let's talk about what's in store for people who come to your meeting. When is it on this year?
Brett Boyer:
It is on Sunday, July 5th, which is our board meeting day. And we did make it a little later this year. It runs from 5:00 to 7:00 PM, obviously.
Jonathan Mosen:
Oh, well, I'm glad to hear that.
Brett Boyer:
Yeah. We were trying to find unique times, but that one just wasn't on anybody's radar.
Jonathan Mosen:
Well.
Brett Boyer:
But it is hard because there are about four or five other meetings that involve technology and training in different ways, so it does make it a little difficult to schedule along with these things. We tried to make it a little later in hopes that some of the folks could run over and check it out and be a part of our Trainers Division meeting.
What we're offering this year, we have two panel discussions, which is going to be really fun. The first one is focused more on structured discovery tips and tricks and giving trainers the mindset of structured discovery because we have a lot of folks that we're not trained with structured discovery. We have folks that are getting certifications from various places that don't necessarily adopt the structured discovery method, and trainers have to sort of use structured discovery within those boundaries. We're really hoping to reach out to those trainers and really show why structured discovery works, how it works, and the difference. When you teach a student with structured discovery in mind as opposed to, like you said, rote memorization, it's one thing to tell somebody, "Press Windows/E, press shift/tab, press this, hit enter, hit tab," but it's more important to know why. Why are they doing that? And what happens if that doesn't work? If Windows/E for some reason someday just doesn't work, maybe your Windows key is broken. Maybe Microsoft came up with a new update. We know how much companies like to update software and break little things here and there.
It's something I compare a lot to when you're going out on travel, you don't just learn routes, you learn how to travel. If you're walking down a sidewalk that you walk down every day and today there's a car parked or a sign that's there, what do you do about it? Do you walk around it? Do you turn around and go home and cry? These are the kinds of things that we want to make sure our students are feeling resilient and being resilient about it.
Our second panel is going to be something really new and cool that I think you're going to really like. I don't want to give away all the surprises on who's going to be on these panels, but we definitely have some great folks in the industry to offer some of their suggestions. And this one's on multiline Braille displays. Because it's so new and so different, a lot of our trainers don't know how to incorporate this or how to move forward. Sometimes we have to be careful when we live in the field that we work, we tend to do things the way we've always done them. And I think multiline Braille displays are a good example of how we should be looking at new adventurous things and trying new things, not just for ourselves, but of course with our students. We're going to be focusing on multiline Braille displays. We're going to have a couple of representatives from a training company, one from APH and an illustrious wonderful guest, not to fanboy out, but we're going to have some great discussion.
And then in the middle, we are going to have our elections. And if time permitting in the middle or at the end, we're definitely going to have an open forum, which is one of my favorite things. One of the things that we've done in the last two years is we've had a few of these pop up, what I call them teacher lounges, where we open up the floodgates and just let teachers talk. We let them ask questions, we let them compare notes, we let them maybe even let something off their chest that they're frustrated with or brag about their wins with students. Because I think one of the things that has happened in the past is there's this competitive nature in this industry of keeping the secrets like, "I have this wonderful exercise, but I'm not going to give it out to other trainers because it's mine." And we're really trying to open that up and make it so we're all learning from each other because honestly, I think we all can learn something. Even if we think we know it all when it comes to technology, there's always going to be something around the corner. Again, this is part of structured discovery.
One of the things we always say in structured discovery is the only thing you should know is that you don't always know. And again, we want to impart that into our students, but we also want to give ourselves that room to explore and be curious, what are other people doing? What are other trainers doing? And it's not necessarily to compare yourself, but it's to take what you can from everyone and to give. And with this give and take, I think we would see a lot more positive of that and less of that competition that sometimes creeps up.
Jonathan Mosen:
And you can join up to become a member of the division; and it's worthwhile to do that. And one of the things that you have been offering is periodically get togethers to discuss these very things. I think the last time you had one was right in the middle of a storm of doom for us here in Maryland. That I was intending to attend that one, and then the storm was just ferocious and crazy things were going on. But there are things that do happen between conventions that you can be a part of as part of the division, and then there's also that email list that people can be a part of and essentially bounce ideas off technology trainers.
Brett Boyer:
Yes. The teachers lounge has been going well. We've done about three a year these last two years. It's one of the things that I started, not to toot my own horn. But it's something that I think has really brought some people together and it's really given me some ideas on how different people are using some of this new technology. We're going to have a mini version of that at our meeting, which hopefully I'd also like to bring some AI discussion in because I'm also a big proponent of AI and the things that it can do for us, not only as blind people, but also as trainers. We're going to have a little taste of that teacher's lounge, hopefully, time permitting, at this meeting as well.
And while you're talking about signing up, I would really like to encourage people. Now, you can come and sign up. 5 dollars is just to help us with the division so they know that we exist. It's also to be able to vote because this year we are doing elections on who's running for the various offices. Down the road, we'd like to put together some extra special content for our members. But you don't have to pay to come to the meeting and you also don't have to pay to sign up to the Trainers Talk email list.
But if you would like to come and be able to vote and let us know who you are so we can start our database and hopefully get some of that special content coming your way, well, we'd love to get your 5 dollars, but we'd really like to get your name and email address. We really are recommending people sign up through the portal, but of course half an hour before the meeting we will have a table set up where people can come and give us their name and number and their dues.
And stick around. I think it's going to be a really fun and exciting meeting. I'm not one for stiff corporate board, quote, unquote. Not bored, B-O-R-E-D, but sometimes they are. It should be fun and interactive. I like to keep things light and casual. Hopefully comes, check out what we have, stick around and see what our trainers are up to.
And even if you're interested in becoming a trainer, and maybe you think, I'm really good at tech; maybe I should become a trainer. Come and talk to us because sometimes someone is really good at tech. Training and being a tech teacher take a little more and are a little different. What do they say? Teaching is 90% performance art, I think I read somewhere. Definitely tech skills are wonderful; and when you're a techie, that's great. But come and talk to us. Come and find out what's the difference between a good tech user and a good tech trainer. We'd love to help and we'd love to encourage our members to come and see what we're doing.
Jonathan Mosen:
Right. Imparting the knowledge is a very different skillset from possessing the knowledge.
Brett Boyer:
Absolutely.
Jonathan Mosen:
Brett Boyer, the hardworking president of our Assistive Technology Trainers Division, just one of the many things that you'll be able to do at the national convention this year. Make a difference with the National Federation of the Blind's Keep NFB Advancing Give 25 campaign. Each year, thousands of federation members and friends contribute to support blind people, but we still need your help to fund our programs in 2026 and beyond. When you give 25 dollars between May 15th and July 7th, you're entered into the Keep NFB Advancing drawing. Each 25 dollars increment is a chance to win. Your support helps us continue to build a network that advances the lives of all blind people across America. You could win prizes like rounds trip transportation for two to the 2027 NFB National Convention, hotel accommodations, registration, banquet tickets, or 2,000 dollars cash.
Speaker 3:
And you can double your dollars up to 25,000 dollars thanks to a gift from Aira, the visual interpreting service.
Jonathan Mosen:
Want a chance to win the BrailleNote Evolve from HumanWare? Become a Federation connector. Ask friends and family to contribute before national convention and indicate that you prompted their giving. The Give 25 Drive supports the Kenneth Jernigan Fund, Sun Fund, Tenbroek Memorial Fund, and the White Cane Fund. You can choose a fund when you donate. To enter, visit nfb.org/give25donate. That's nfb.org/give25donate. Call 410-659-9314, extension 2430, or send a check to National Federation of the Blind and mention #give25 and the fund in the memo. The winner will be announced July 8th, 2026. Thank you for your generosity.
Well, we have a bulging email box, I tell you, to [email protected], so let's get through some of the contributions that we've received. And we'll return to this topic of BBC Radio outside the UK. And Ian Lackey says, "Hello, Jonathan. It's perhaps difficult for me to add anything meaningful to this topic as I live in the UK. However, it might be that the radio receiver app allows BBC radio stations to be heard abroad. This is the app I use for a lot of my radio listening. It's only £3.99 for the fully functional app. I would be interested to know if it allows playing of BBC radio stations outside of the UK."
Thanks, Ian. I would, too. And if anybody tries this app, it would be good to hear whether it's allowing BBC access outside the UK. Because of this discussion, I actually did switch my radio app to Triode, and I'm having great success with that. It's picking up all sorts of streams that I haven't seen for a long time, or in some cases I've never seen before. Triode is a great app and it's developed by the Iconfactory who in days of your when X was Twitter used to make the very popular and accessible Twitterrific app, and they've got a track record of accessibility.
Here's Gareth Williams responding to Jessica's listener email of some time back about ooTunes. And Gareth says, "Hi, Jonathan. When in a saved recording on ooTunes, the button to press and hold to share the recording is called save current recording. After about 15 years, I've only just discovered this thanks to trying to solve Jessica's problem. I wonder if she was trying to use the start recording button. I hope she has not restored her phone and deleted her recordings." I hope not either, Gareth. Thank you for taking the trouble to investigate that.
Here's Mike Bullis. He says, "Fascinating discussion with Arielle Silverman. In the last couple of years, all my web browsing/surfing are now AI questions. I ask for specific links about where the information comes from. The process is so much faster than scrolling through Google advertisements. Any negatives are far outweighed by the positives. The real changes I have noted recently with ChatGPT and Gemini are that the AI is thinking more. At one time, I could tell that the AI was simply looking for keywords, but now the AI really does engage in a thought process. Fascinating.
"Broadly, the social upheaval barreling towards us is going to be massive in terms of job losses, and there's no incentive in American business to protect employees' jobs. There is a fundamental that is being overlooked by most prognosticators of the future. It is that we humans are hardwired to work every day to put food on our table and provide ourselves with shelter. This is built into our genes. Take this away and you have a formula for social disaster. Most people simply aren't going to be able to adjust to an environment where their work is not necessary or valued.
Historians argue that every major technology innovation in the past has always resulted in more jobs rather than less, but that I fear is wishful thinking not supported by facts. AI is the steam engine, electricity, railroad, jet airliner, and nuclear power all rolled into one and more. I'm concerned that wishing it away just won't work." That's a thought-provoking email, Mike. I appreciate you sending it and I look forward to further comments, [email protected] if you would like to join in on that AI discussion.
Charlie is writing in from South Africa. He says, "I just wanted to share some feedback about the Speaky AI app, specifically its current state and how it could be improved for more advanced users like myself. Now, I'm not going to claim I'm a perfect Android user; far from it. To be honest, I'd much rather have an iPhone in my hands, preferably an iPhone 17 with two terabytes of storage. But if you're not in that price bracket yet, you take what you can and call it a day.
"I previously had an iPhone SE 2020, which served me well for four years until the battery got pregnant. Unfortunately, I couldn't help it deliver the baby." Well, that sounds pretty dramatic, Charlie. "To save us both the stress, I just switched it off and let it be pregnant in peace. That's when I pulled out my old Samsung Galaxy Note 10 from the drawer. Despite the issues it had, even with basic functions, I stuck with it until I could afford something better. For now, I'm using the Samsung Galaxy A36 as my daily driver.
"Now, if you're using a phone as your daily driver, you don't want anything getting in your way. Unfortunately, Speaky AI relies heavily on voice commands. When it's active, almost everything has to be done through voice. This makes simple tasks like making calls, interacting with apps, or sending emails unnecessarily complicated. One major issue is that it disables the back, home, and recent apps buttons entirely. Trust me, I've tried everything. The only workaround is to lock the phone using the side button, unlock it again, and then use a two-finger gesture just to regain some control. It's quite a mission.
"Don't get me wrong, the app is actually quite nifty. For someone who has recently lost their sight and isn't yet comfortable with gestures or swipes, it could be incredibly helpful. But unfortunately, I'm not in that category. I do enjoy dictation, clearly, so I'm dictating this email right now, but I wouldn't want to use my phone purely through voice commands. That's just not how I operate daily.
"Another suggestion would be to rethink the app's structure. Having to download multiple companion apps just to access different features is cumbersome. Personally, I'd much rather download one large all-in-one app rather than deal with several smaller ones scattered across my phone. It also becomes a headache when you want to re-enable something later and can't even find all the pieces. I understand the app is still in development, especially with a public beta or full release on the horizon, but consolidating everything into a single app would make a huge difference in usability.
"Do I like the app? Yes, it's a great concept. But would I use it daily? Honestly, no. And knowing you, Jonathan, you probably would've been frustrated with it long ago. One thing I like though is that you can contact technical support directly from within the app, although I half expect that that's to require another companion app too. Just kidding."
Thanks so much, Charlie. I think this app is seeking to cater to a unique market, and predominantly I think that would be seniors, people who may be struggling with technology because there's a lot going on in their lives. Maybe they can't find training as readily. And I think that is an important market because sometimes we forget that that's the majority of blind people, in fact. And we have concerns about that demographic being left out of all of this technological change, so it's great that someone with your technical ability is kicking the tires that will add value, but you're probably not the target demographic, I don't think. But that's a good review of your experience, and I appreciate that.
Here's a concerning email from Mike who says, "Hi, I have been made aware that Bose is planning on eliminating voice prompts from their headphones, which currently announce battery level and connection status. They will replace the voice prompts with tones. I find this very upsetting, as I have used Bose products for years because of the voice accessibility features. I wonder if any of your listeners have reported this to you. I was told by a phone rep that this is the way the company is planning on going as a way to reduce battery usage, which makes no sense to me.
Does the NFB have any contact with the Bose team to express this concern? I hope you'll find this issue worth investigating. I have several blind and no vision friends in the San Francisco Bay Area who say they'll no longer update their headphones because of this issue. I will be holding off purchasing new headphones for my upcoming trip until I see whether the issue is resolved."
Mike, thank you so much. We have been made aware of this. And I really appreciate you sending in the email and also to others who have brought this to our attention. Apparently it's pretty widespread and is making its presence felt in several Bose products where there previously were voice prompts.
We absolutely understand the frustration and concerns around this, and we'll reach out and see if we can establish any connections. Sometimes it is possible for the Federation to just get beyond that first level tech support, so we'll see what we can do and certainly keep people posted on progress.
Of course, all of the listener contributions we receive are important, but I think this is a particularly important discussion, and I hope that we can have a conversation via this podcast on this important topic. The contribution comes from Michael Evers. He says, "A recent trainer talk discussion about remote AT training opportunities raised an issue that I have been thinking about for some time.
Many organizations and school systems appear to be placing increasing emphasis on formal certifications, K-12 experience, or other credentials. I understand the importance of standards and quality assurance, especially when working with students. However, I also believe the current model may unintentionally exclude many highly capable blind professionals who have decades of lived experience, practical AT knowledge, informal training experience, and professional leadership backgrounds.
"In my own case, I have been using and helping others learn assistive technology for more than 30 years. I've also worked in higher education accessibility services and have trained, supported, and mentored blind students and professionals in real world environments. I do not claim to know everything, but I do believe that firsthand daily use of assistive technology has real value that should not be dismissed simply because someone lacks a particular certification.
"My concern is that some agencies seem to expect blind professionals to obtain expensive certifications on their own or to rely on vocational rehabilitation to subsidize them. I do not believe this is a sustainable solution. If these certifications are becoming essential for employment, then employers, agencies, school systems, and partnering organizations should consider creating paid pathways, apprenticeships, mentorships, or employer-sponsored certification programs.
Otherwise, the field may continue to struggle to find qualified AT trainers while overlooking blind professionals who already have substantial practical expertise. I believe Access On would be an excellent place to explore this issue, including what certifications are truly necessary, how lived experience should be weighed, and how the blindness field can build more realistic pathways into assistive technology training careers."
Michael, this is a really interesting subject. I'm so glad you raised it. And I'm just going to open it up at this point. I have opinions on this, but really I'd like to hear from listeners about what you think of this issue that Mike has raised. Are we getting to the point where blind people are being disadvantaged at both ends? Firstly, the people who need the training because they're missing out on skilled, capable, blind people who happen not to have the certification, and of course blind people who seek to train and help others out who have the ability to do so, but not the certification.
Does certification in this field matter? Be in touch, [email protected]. Access On is all one word. You can attach an audio clip to the email if you'd like to give everybody a break from my voice, or you can also write the email down, whatever works for you.
Kevin says, "Hi, Jonathan. I really like the Access On episode you did about Tailscale. I've been using it for a few years now and love it. I use it for what you were demoing, particularly accessing files on my desktop when I'm mobile and also sometimes using NVDA remote to control it. I'm writing to ask you what NAS you use. Does it come with its own storage or do I also need to buy hard drives to put in it? The reason I'm asking is that I'm sure if you were able to set up a NAS, it might be accessible enough for me too. I'm not sure if all NASs are accessible to set up, and I didn't want to pick just any one off the market."
Thanks for writing in, Kevin. I personally at home have a Synology NAS. I forget the model number now. There are so many cryptic NAS numbers from Synology. It reminds me of the old Nokia phone days where the model numbers really didn't make a lot of sense. This may vary from model to model and what you're wanting, but in the case of Synology, yes, it would be typical for you to buy the network attached storage device and connect it to your network, and then you would choose the hard drives. And these NAS devices have a varying number of bays.
In the case of the one that I have, it is just a two-bay drive, and I have it set up in a raid configuration. I have two eight terabyte drives, and they are mirroring one another so that if there's some sort of data loss on one, chances are you can restore from the other one.
I also have the NAS backing certain critical folders up to cloud storage, including Dropbox and OneDrive. Some of the files I have, for example, like radio shows that I've been doing for decades now, I have archives there, and if I lost those, I wouldn't be able to replace them because those files are unique to me. Those are the ones where I do some redundancy by backing up not just to the Synology NAS but also to cloud storage.
Synology uses an operating system to power its NAS. I think it's all Linux under the hood. It's called DSM, disc station management. It's a little bit quirky with a screen reader, but it is doable. And if you're the person that likes to dabble in the command line, you can set it up so that you can just get to a shell prompt, a terminal prompt and do all your administration that way.
And the thing is, once you've created the initial users and your directories, it pretty much just runs itself. I very seldom have to play with it or maintain it or anything like that. It also has some very accessible iOS apps. And since it's just a network attached storage drive, you can connect it to the files app and do all those sorts of things. Tailscale does make it easy for you to access the NAS without exposing it to the wider world.
That's the one that I am personally familiar with that was recommended to me by somebody I trust a long time ago, and I've stuck with Synology ever since, but they're not the only game in town. If anybody has any other recommendations and experiences to share about network attached storage devices, please do share them with us; that'd be a great discussion and very helpful, [email protected].
The subject line of this email from Elko Canfield caught my attention immediately because the subject is My New, Wonderful Kitchen Assistant. And the email says, "My old air fryer was dying, and so I bought the Emerson 10QT talking air fryer. It is absolutely amazing. You don't need to pair it with any other device. It comes out of the box ready to talk and interact. It has over 1,000 commands and 100 different recipes that it has stored. I hope you will review this product because it is absolutely fantastic." That does sound pretty intriguing, Elko. Thank you so much. We will look into this.
Let's talk audio now. And this email says, "Hi, this is Peg Jolene from Lincoln, Nebraska and a member of our Lincoln chapter of the National Federation of the Blind. At our state convention in early May, I gave a presentation very much on the order of Access On episode 74 and including apps at no cost or low cost and a demo of WayAround tags. My intention was for the breakout session to be very interactive, and my fellow federationists played the game well.
"Tech-wise, I had created samples of some video description apps using Listen Later for accessing PDF documents along with samples using ScribeMe. Because I had no knowledge of what my setup would be, I intended to use a speaker for the Victory to Stream three to play these samples, avoiding relying on the internet and unpredictable PA systems. However, that idea was a fail as, for the most part, sound, et cetera could not be coordinated using just a microphone.
"Similar tech issues occurred throughout the convention, many relating to a combination of Zoom and using the PA systems for the convention audience. Since this was happening to the pros, I decided I was in good company, but given that I/we continue to present in chapter meetings, divisions, and groups, I'm hoping to find a solution.
I own accessible tools, including the Zoom PodTrak P4, the Zoom PodTrak P4next, and have access to the Zoom H4 Essential and Zoom H6 Essential. Can I create some sort of sound system that can be used in a breakout session? In this instance, the room had a table and chair set up to accommodate 48 participants. Looking forward to your suggestions."
Yes, Peg, I think this is possible. Let's dissect what you've told me and see if we can come up with a solution. I think the PodTrak P4 or the PodTrak P4next would be good options for forming the basis of what you want to do. This would allow you to plug microphones into the P4 or P4next so that people can then be heard when they talk. For ease of use, it might be good to go with wireless microphones in that situation, otherwise you could have very long microphone cables trying to get around those 48 participants who want to talk.
Will Schwatka here at the Jernigan Institute knows many things about all sorts of audio and video things, and we were talking about this in the context of another affiliate and he was recommending some low cost wireless microphones from a company called Phenyx, P-H-E-N-Y-X. They come quite highly regarded. And you would be able to connect the wireless receivers to the XLR jacks of the Zoom PodTrak P4 or P4next.
After that would come the speakers. And the really important thing here is that you get a speaker that doesn't use any processing or anything that will introduce latency because what that will mean is that when somebody speaks into the mic, it will sound a bit like an echo because there's a delay, so you just want a very simple speaker system.
Probably a powered speaker system is best with no latency or processing that will plug into the line out jack, of the PodTrak P4next. To minimize the risk of feedback, you want to keep some distance between the microphone and the speaker system. If you get microphones that are highly directional and have a narrow pickup pattern, you'll reduce the possibility of feedback as well. But you will want some distance. That gets everybody in the room hearing each other through a PA system that's plugged into the line out and those wireless microphones.
What you could then do is use a computer or smartphone and either the USB cable or the TRRS jack to bring in the Zoom guests. And they would be able to hear everybody talking into the microphones on the PodTrak P4next, and the mix minus feature would mean that Zoom guests wouldn't hear themselves echoing back, although they might get a little bit from the speakers potentially.
But normally Zoom has adequate noise cancellation to take care of that, so I think you should be okay. The Zoom guests would come through the same speakers that the people using the microphones would come through and everybody would be able to hear each other clearly. Those Zoom guests would be able to hear people in the room very clearly.
In those situations where you want to play something such as the demos that you recorded, the PodTrak has the ability to load up to four files and the little bank there, and you can just play them with the press of a button. It's pretty cool if you think about the presidential release, for example. Just ahead of time, you can load that into one of the buttons, and when it's time to play it, just press that button. The Zoom guests will hear it very clearly and so will the people in the room.
You would also be able to record the whole thing on the P4next itself, which is great if you want historical recordings or you just want a good recording for minutes taking. Indeed, you could potentially take that recording, feed it to an AI provider that specializes in minutes and get a first draft, which of course you'd want a human to review for accuracy of those minutes.
But if you have a presentation and you want to take that presentation and put it on the website or social media, you would have very good quality audio of that presentation to work with, including all the questions, whether they came virtually or in the room heard very clearly as long as the people in the room pick up one of those wireless mics. Peg, I hope that's helpful.
It is time for another message from Christopher Wright. He says, "Hi, Jonathan. It's really exciting to see Microsoft constantly improving Narrator again. I don't have a Braille display that supports HID, but it's wonderful we're finally getting that in Windows. I also read in the Windows Insider release notes that you'll be able to connect your display during the Windows Out-of-Box Experience so you'll have full access while setting up the system for the first time or after a reset. Hopefully, this also extends to the Windows recovery environment so a blind person can independently install the operating system or fix other problems using Braille.
I still wish Microsoft would focus on making other features like Quick Assist and Hyper-V fully accessible so we aren't left out, but this probably isn't a high priority at the moment due to all the Copilot development, which I personally don't care about. If Apple can make Mac remote controlled accessible to voiceover users, there's no reason Microsoft can't do the same with Narrator.
"As for Apple, I hope they bring fully accessible remote control to the iPhone and iPad this year. It baffles me they prioritized it for the Mac last year but not anything else. In fact, you'd think iOS and iPad OS devices would have been prioritized for such a feature given their track record.
"I'm also hoping for many voiceover bug fixes on Mac OS, but I'm not holding my breath. What we really need is a full OS cycle like 28 where there are literally no new features or design changes and all they do is optimize every component of the system, remove old code, et cetera. Unfortunately, that's not exciting to the masses and won't help them sell the annual phone, so I call this a major pipe dream." Thank you, Christopher. Good to get your thoughts.
Beth from Virginia Beach says, "Hey, Jonathan, very interesting about the trials and tribulations concerning the future of Google search. On a public call, one of the TTJ tech Apple blindness training company trainers stated that she did not want an AI bot, she wanted research only, and Perplexity is the only AI she trusts or uses. She said Perplexity is accurate and has never given her hallucinations. Since I know and trust the TTJ people, I have done the same, and Perplexity is great. I do about all my research using that now. It gives you the sources it gets the info from. I find it easy to use on the iPhone. I have enjoyed the webinars you guys have done. Keep it up."
Well, thank you, Beth. I appreciate that. Perplexity is very good. You can do deep research on the other models by choosing the research option. That is available in Gemini, Claude and ChatGPT, probably others as well. One of the advantages that Perplexity possesses, if you're willing to pay for that, is that you can search across several services and they can aggregate the results for you, so it does have some pretty compelling benefits for sure.
Russ Terrick:
Hey, Jonathan, this is Russ Terrick from Grand Junction, Colorado, and I was really excited to hear you mention Tovala. I have been an active subscriber for over four and a half years. Currently, I'm not receiving any meals because I just don't need the convenience right now. The food is absolutely delicious, but what drew me to Tovala is the convenience. The app is easy to use. The buttons are a little more complicated because you can go up and down, and you hear them beepish push them.
But if you can use the app, you can use the oven. The meals come fresh with a card, and you can of course scan the card with Meta glasses or a scanner and read it, but there is a QR code on the top of the card. And below the top of the oven on the right-hand side is a scanner, and you push a button, the top button for scanning, it reads the information, and when it acknowledges it gives you two beeps, a lower and then a higher beep.
The people at Tovala are absolutely helpful. I requested that the information for cooking on each card be put on the webpage so every meal you get, if you want to look at what the times are, what it takes. And it cooks in many stages. It might start steaming, it might broil, then it bakes. It's essentially a convection oven. And as I said before, it bakes, it broils. There are two models. One is a little door, and you can add water for steam and the other doesn't have it, but the cards work the same way. They're very helpful. They're very quick to respond. I looked into Brava and some of the other options, and this was the least expensive.
My sister lost her husband and asked me about it because she'd heard I used it, and I referred her and I got meal credits and she got an oven for about 100 dollars. The only requirement was that she subscribe to a 16 meal plan. At that point, you can quit. You don't have to go back. And it's just a great option. If anybody's interested, I'd certainly be happy to talk with anybody about it. It is a great purchase, it's a wonderful value, and the meals are fantastic.
Jonathan Mosen:
Russ, I really appreciate you sending that. And thank you, it's great to get that real world user experience. Some of the team here who have tried it agree with you. They did very kindly make an appointment on my calendar so that I could go up and participate in the testing of the Tovala oven. And I think I had claim on the steak that they sent, the filet that they sent. But when the time came, I was so snowed under here that I did not get up to test it.
But some other members here of our NFB Center of Excellence and Non-visual Accessibility have tested it. They concur with your analysis of how good the app is and the user experience. They would like it to offer a little bit more audible feedback; maybe beep a bit more in places on the oven itself. But the app seems to be in very good shape, so that's promising. And we'll get somebody from Tovala on Access On at some point to tell us more, but if others have experiences to share, please feel free to send them in.
And just before I go, we have had quite a few emails to Access On from Stephen Gigger and quite a few other listeners who reported a degradation of their Amazon Alexa devices where certain devices were losing the tones that acknowledged when Alexa was listening and also when it had stopped listening. It wasn't all the Alexa devices, but it was consistent across certain devices. Thanks to all the feedback that people sent in via the Access On email and various other channels, we were able to assemble a very comprehensive report for Amazon.
We are able to get beyond that first level tech support. We let them know. They responded very quickly and said, "Yep, we hadn't heard about this before. We're on it now and we are rolling out a fix." And my understanding is that as this episode is published, quite a few devices have already seen that fix, so thank you. This is the power of collective advocacy. You let us know, we were able to take it up on your behalf, and we are getting a fix rolled out.
That concludes this episode of Access On, the technology podcast of the National Federation of the Blind. To send in a contribution for a future episode, email us, attach an audio clip, or just write it down and send it to [email protected]. That's [email protected]. To keep up to date with Access On, follow us on Mastadon, [email protected]. That's [email protected] on Mastadon.
To subscribe to an announcements only email list about upcoming episodes, send a blank message to [email protected]. That's [email protected]. To learn more about the National Federation of the Blind, visit our website, nfb.org or phone us, 410-659-9314. That's 410-659-9314. And be sure to check out the Nation's Blind Podcast right from where you heard this podcast.